Shorter games ?

Open now for discussion of all things Darlo!

Moderators: mikkyx, uncovered

lo36789
Posts: 9224
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2011 10:58 pm
Team Supported: Darlington
Location: Liverpool

Re: Shorter games ?

Post by lo36789 » Fri Jan 08, 2021 7:27 pm

"technical skill level" is obviously subjective.

- Bigger population
- Wider pool from where players are sourced
- Greater access to facilities and opportunities
- Greater financial motivation
- Higher levels of investment in player development at youth level

Tells me standards would be greater now than in the past but when it boils down to individual player v individual player comparisons there is no definitive measure of technical skill.

Anyway the main point was what used to be done was fine at the standards back then but it comes with a cost. A lot of players still play two games a weekend (Saturday and Sunday) but they don't tend to play above step 4 on a Saturday and Sunday league is of a certain standard below that.

biccynana
Posts: 862
Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2015 11:38 am
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Shorter games ?

Post by biccynana » Fri Jan 08, 2021 8:07 pm

Old Git wrote:
Fri Jan 08, 2021 12:23 pm

More recently in 2015/16 when we won the Evostik Premier League we had to play 3 times a week if memory is correct.
Nine games in 21 days between 2 and 23 April.

EDJOHNS
Posts: 892
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2019 3:56 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Shorter games ?

Post by EDJOHNS » Sat Jan 09, 2021 9:44 am

banktopp wrote:
Fri Jan 08, 2021 4:33 pm
don'tbuythesun wrote:
Fri Jan 08, 2021 4:11 pm
Don't agree,there have always been technically gifted players but they are, I'm sure fitter now. Some of us will remember the dreadful surfaces they played on, so energy draining and only one substitute. Gerry Byrne played the 65 cup final with a broken collar bone. Real tough players abounded and they played through all sorts of injuries. Tackling was ferocious!
Only one substitute came in 1965. Only one stretcher at Feethams, when Henderson was dragged off with broken leg. Whitehead also broke his leg
in the same game and was occupying the stretcher. Can still remember the awful crack when he broke it.
A game no-one who was there will ever forget. Don't forget Jack Maltby was also injured and could hardly move but stayed on and played to the end.
3-0 to Stockport when we needed the extra stretcher and with virtually 8 men came back to only loose 3-2. This just days after we sold them French who was somehow involved in 2 of the 3 injuries and the week before we went to Donny who hit double figures.

Wiseacre
Posts: 230
Joined: Thu Oct 04, 2018 7:57 pm
Team Supported: Darlington &Notts County

Re: Shorter games ?

Post by Wiseacre » Sat Jan 09, 2021 11:58 am

Old Git wrote:
Thu Jan 07, 2021 8:17 pm
Have I just woken from winter hibernation on April 1st ?
Wonderful if we could wake up on April 1 and be able to start looking forward. Maybe I'm over the top with this, but the possible consequences of the pandemic are so unpredictable and serious that football could be swept off the agenda completely. I noticed Steve Bruce saying something last week about feeling it's 'immoral' to continue playing at the moment. He could be seen to have other reasons for Newcastle to be mothballed but I wonder if he's alone in this view. I'm getting fed up of news feeds about who one big club should sign or how another's manager isn't as sharp as he was last season. If we're all supposed to be staying at home doesn't that mean recreational sport? With games going down like premiership strikers shouldn't we just tolerate a cancelled season and government pay out?

jjljks
Posts: 2160
Joined: Thu Oct 29, 2015 10:25 am
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Shorter games ?

Post by jjljks » Sun Jan 10, 2021 8:58 am

Wiseacre has a point, at least a break until end of the lockdown, otherwise we will continue to be treated to games like Aston Villa U18s v Liverpool or even Chorlton winning FA Cup as the only side without Covid. Add in a cold snap causing as many postponements as Jan 9th in the NLN & the whole thing ends in a shambles.

quaker4life
Posts: 2430
Joined: Thu Jul 09, 2009 9:24 pm
Team Supported: Darlington
Contact:

Re: Shorter games ?

Post by quaker4life » Sun Jan 10, 2021 10:07 am

I've held back on commenting recently but after that debacle between the police and those two women in Derbyshire and then seeing the scenes in Chorley's dressing room at full time yesterday I can't help but feel there is something fundamentally wrong somewhere. Apparently it's against "the spirit of lockdown" to go to a remote location 5 miles from your home with a hamper in a coffee cup but it is acceptable for a group of blokes to gather under one roof at a time when households mixing is apparently forbidden? I have to admit at times it makes it difficult to take the restrictions seriously.

Of course I don't wish to take anything away from Chorley but the whole situation was farcical the fact none of Derby's senior players or management were available should have been a cause for postponement in itself the same goes for Villa V Liverpool from the snippets I've seen on the news both matches resembled behind closed doors friendlies against academy sides as opposed to FA Cup Third Round ties, again I realise this will have been an incredible experience and a dream come true for those young players but it made a mockery of the competition and undermined it's integrity.

Looking at the NLN table alone it's quite shocking at a stage under normal circumstances where we would have played around 25 league games some teams have only played 12, Darlo playing just 10. So in effect approximately 6/7 months worth of fixtures will now have to played between now and the end of May which is absolute insanity, from a personal perspective I don't think this season should have kicked off and it should have already been brought to a halt at all levels given the current situation. Although from a practical point of view it would he an utter shambles if consecutive seasons had to be curtailed and I wouldn't be surprised to see it go beyond May 29th at a time when matches are lost to the weather and no doubt more being lost to Covid-19 between now and then it's going to be a logistical nightmare.

Good luck to Alun and the lads negotiating 32 games in 19 weeks!
love it! wrote:Considering we are Darlington 1883 I'm happy that we are named correctly

Old Git
Posts: 895
Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2019 9:09 am
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Shorter games ?

Post by Old Git » Sun Jan 10, 2021 10:24 am

quaker4life wrote:
Sun Jan 10, 2021 10:07 am
I've held back on commenting recently but after that debacle between the police and those two women in Derbyshire and then seeing the scenes in Chorley's dressing room at full time yesterday I can't help but feel there is something fundamentally wrong somewhere. Apparently it's against "the spirit of lockdown" to go to a remote location 5 miles from your home with a hamper in a coffee cup but it is acceptable for a group of blokes to gather under one roof at a time when households mixing is apparently forbidden? I have to admit at times it makes it difficult to take the restrictions seriously.

Of course I don't wish to take anything away from Chorley but the whole situation was farcical the fact none of Derby's senior players or management were available should have been a cause for postponement in itself the same goes for Villa V Liverpool from the snippets I've seen on the news both matches resembled behind closed doors friendlies against academy sides as opposed to FA Cup Third Round ties, again I realise this will have been an incredible experience and a dream come true for those young players but it made a mockery of the competition and undermined it's integrity.

Looking at the NLN table alone it's quite shocking at a stage under normal circumstances where we would have played around 25 league games some teams have only played 12, Darlo playing just 10. So in effect approximately 6/7 months worth of fixtures will now have to played between now and the end of May which is absolute insanity, from a personal perspective this season should not have kicked off and it would he an utter shambles if consecutive seasons had to be curtailed but from a practical point of view I wouldn't be surprised to see it go beyond May 29th at a time when matches are lost to the weather and no doubt more being lost to Covid-19 between now and then it's going to be a logistical nightmare.

Good luck to Alun and the lads negotiating 32 games in 19 weeks!
There are a lot of anomalies in the current lockdown which you rightly point out. Football at our level is full of them. If any one of the Chorley players or staff in that changing room was carrying the virus then it would be a super spreading situation. If 1 in 50 of the population are positive then there would be a good chance of someone in that room being infected. It would certainly take the gloss off the day if some of the players were to catch Covid and even worse go home and pass it on to older relatives.
I think this season may have to be written off and we plan for players to return in late June early July with a view to starting next season as normal in August. Hopefully by then fans can be present and we can all enjoy the football in a more relaxed manner.

User avatar
theoriginalfatcat
Posts: 4868
Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 7:40 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Shorter games ?

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Sun Jan 10, 2021 1:55 pm

Good point O.G. Was every person in that Chorley dressing room tested yesterday?
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

Tamworth matchday programme 26 Nov 2011

biccynana
Posts: 862
Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2015 11:38 am
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Shorter games ?

Post by biccynana » Sun Jan 10, 2021 6:15 pm

jjljks wrote:
Sun Jan 10, 2021 8:58 am
even Chorlton winning FA Cup.
Those wheels give them an unfair advantage, I reckon.

en passant
Posts: 415
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2015 10:17 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Shorter games ?

Post by en passant » Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:10 am

Reading through this thread and watching the news has got me wondering about the idea that we might as well scrap this season with the hope that there may be a chance to have a more normal season next year. Some of the chances of getting back to normal will depend on the roll out of the vaccine. Accepting that some people may never want to take it, there will still be some 60 million plus who would need to be inoculated. The government seems to believe that it is possible to roll this out at a pace of two million a week, which would get us to some 26-28 million vaccinated in the first 3 months. According to the new advice on second doses, this will then require all of that first 26-28 million to be vaccinated again, which should, if the rate of roll out is maintained, mean that it will take another 3 months to complete the vaccination of the first tranche. That would take us to the end of June. The people in this first grouping will only be the most elderly, key workers, possibly teachers, but certainly not people of football playing age. It may be that having completed the vaccination of 26-28 million will have such a positive effect on the population in general that transmission rates are reduced to negligible levels, or that the roll out can be significantly quickened, but as it looks at the moment it appears that even next season will have to start under a Covid restrictions, which may have to continue way into next year when everyone has had the vaccine. This season does look to have skids under it and any more bad weather or further Covid outbreaks will surely make it impossible to complete, but we may not have a clear run at next season either.

H1987
Posts: 1776
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2016 4:14 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Shorter games ?

Post by H1987 » Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:26 am

en passant wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:10 am
Reading through this thread and watching the news has got me wondering about the idea that we might as well scrap this season with the hope that there may be a chance to have a more normal season next year. Some of the chances of getting back to normal will depend on the roll out of the vaccine. Accepting that some people may never want to take it, there will still be some 60 million plus who would need to be inoculated. The government seems to believe that it is possible to roll this out at a pace of two million a week, which would get us to some 26-28 million vaccinated in the first 3 months. According to the new advice on second doses, this will then require all of that first 26-28 million to be vaccinated again, which should, if the rate of roll out is maintained, mean that it will take another 3 months to complete the vaccination of the first tranche. That would take us to the end of June. The people in this first grouping will only be the most elderly, key workers, possibly teachers, but certainly not people of football playing age. It may be that having completed the vaccination of 26-28 million will have such a positive effect on the population in general that transmission rates are reduced to negligible levels, or that the roll out can be significantly quickened, but as it looks at the moment it appears that even next season will have to start under a Covid restrictions, which may have to continue way into next year when everyone has had the vaccine. This season does look to have skids under it and any more bad weather or further Covid outbreaks will surely make it impossible to complete, but we may not have a clear run at next season either.
Agreed. They're now claiming all adults will be vaccinated by Autumn. I'll believe that when I see it. I expect numbers will recede in the summer anyway, as they did last year, which buys us time. We will have a miserable couple of months and hopefully, beyond that, there will be a very slow return to normality (over a year or so).

I think we need to accept a few things.

1) Cancel Euro 2021. It's unfeasible to delay it any further because of the world cup, the uniquely stupid format of this tournament makes things difficult, and it's unfeasible we can have full crowds by summer. We should also not be encouraging huge numbers of fans to travel internationally (and the 'hosting' of this tournament was always wrong to begin with, and should never be considered again). Behind closed doors just sounds crap for this, and i'd sooner we just scrapped it altogether, and sort out domestic calendars around Europe.

2) Extend the season. I'd argue we should maybe take a break of a few weeks anyway, as highlighted above, some of the measures aren't really compatible with this lower level of sport, and it sends a mixed message. It's one thing Premier League players who are tested regularly playing, it's another at our level, when guys have other jobs and aren't tested with any regularity.

Regarding the breaks in the season, someone mentioned we will have 32 games in 19 weeks. That's assuming no more covid outbreaks in our squad (subtract two weeks) and other teams having outbreaks, causing cancellations (see last weekend). So it won't be 32 games in 19 weeks. It will be much, much less. It is also causing some farcical games where youth teams are having to play. Even Boro lost half of their squad this week (and I assume it would've been the full squad like Derby but they had full testing that week, so managed to keep some first-teamers for their game). Are Derby going to have to play their next league game like that too? Possibly not if they don't have a midweek game, but it'll be a matter of time before other teams have to. At which point, where is the integrity of the competition? The FA Cup will be tarnished if future rounds are also like this.

spen666
Posts: 1985
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 9:12 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Shorter games ?

Post by spen666 » Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:57 am

H1987 wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:26 am
....
I think we need to accept a few things.

1) Cancel Euro 2021. It's unfeasible to delay it any further because of the world cup, the uniquely stupid format of this tournament makes things difficult, and it's unfeasible we can have full crowds by summer. We should also not be encouraging huge numbers of fans to travel internationally (and the 'hosting' of this tournament was always wrong to begin with, and should never be considered again). Behind closed doors just sounds crap for this, and i'd sooner we just scrapped it altogether, and sort out domestic calendars around Europe.

....

However sensible this sounds to match going football fans - we are irrelevant - TV companies dictate what happens. Just as Premiershit is going on behind closed doors because TV companies insisted on getting what they had paid for - so the TV companies will decide whether the Euros go ahead.

Sadly at the top level the views of the paying through the turnstile customers are irrelevant


If this pandemic has proven anything, its that match going fans matter less the further up the pyramid you go

jjljks
Posts: 2160
Joined: Thu Oct 29, 2015 10:25 am
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Shorter games ?

Post by jjljks » Mon Jan 11, 2021 2:09 pm

Anyone remember the Liverpool v Atletico Madrid last year? Not just a bad result on the pitch for Liverpool FC but also a superspreader event which knocked the whole country. We can do without the Euros this year.

User avatar
theoriginalfatcat
Posts: 4868
Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 7:40 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Shorter games ?

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Mon Jan 11, 2021 3:49 pm

spen666 wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:57 am
However sensible this sounds to match going football fans - we are irrelevant - TV companies dictate what happens. Just as Premiershit is going on behind closed doors because TV companies insisted on getting what they had paid for - so the TV companies will decide whether the Euros go ahead.
But you could look at it the other way round. The football clubs could have given the money back or not taken the payments - oh, they'd already spent it!

Anyway, what's wrong in getting what you've paid for? Which the TV companies haven't really got anyway because the viewing pleasure is nowhere near the same with no fans inside the stadiums.

What I'm saying Spen is, don't blame the TV companies, this issue isn't their fault.
Mr Singh said this " I'm not expecting to get back any of the money I've already put in, I'm prepared to write it off for the future of the club. I'm not hanging in to make any kind of financial gain in the short or long term - if someone was prepared to come in and take the club off my hands, I'd be more than willing to discuss it"

Tamworth matchday programme 26 Nov 2011

spen666
Posts: 1985
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 9:12 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Shorter games ?

Post by spen666 » Mon Jan 11, 2021 4:07 pm

[...
Last edited by spen666 on Mon Jan 11, 2021 4:48 pm, edited 2 times in total.

spen666
Posts: 1985
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 9:12 pm
Team Supported: Darlington

Re: Shorter games ?

Post by spen666 » Mon Jan 11, 2021 4:47 pm

spen666 wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 4:07 pm
theoriginalfatcat wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 3:49 pm
spen666 wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:57 am
However sensible this sounds to match going football fans - we are irrelevant - TV companies dictate what happens. Just as Premiershit is going on behind closed doors because TV companies insisted on getting what they had paid for - so the TV companies will decide whether the Euros go ahead.
But you could look at it the other way round. The football clubs could have given the money back or not taken the payments - oh, they'd already spent it!

Anyway, what's wrong in getting what you've paid for? Which the TV companies haven't really got anyway because the viewing pleasure is nowhere near the same with no fans inside the stadiums.

What I'm saying Spen is, don't blame the TV companies, this issue isn't their fault.


I'm not blaming anyone.

i'm merely stating what I perceive as being the situation. I have no problem with TV company either getting what they have paid for, or their money back.

TV companies called the shots before lockdown as well, hence FA Cup final on Saturday night when, if its a northern team in final , fans can't get a train home.

KO times switched or even days at relatively short notice to suit TV etc

Post Reply