Short-termism

[lo36789]

For once you post a lot of sense.

monkey and type-writer comes to mind

[Nigel Batches Beard]

For once you post a lot of sense.

monkey and type-writer comes to mind

wish id thought of that one

[Nigel Batches Beard]

in relation to an earlier post re Singhs involvement and a hypothetical Arena return?
Dont think the goalposts have changed much since I last applied for one, but Football Foundation Grant rules mean a minimum 25 year lease on the ground has to be in place ( my club had to have ours extended to qualify) and there is certainly a repayment clause in place for a certain period unless the club folds - so getting out of that length of lease coupled with grant repayment wouldnt be cheap.

[liddle_4_ever]

A number of you so called supporters of Darlington FC should take a look at yourselves and ask whether your actions are actually supporting or harming the club.

Yes, things could be done differently.

Have the lessons of earlier this year not been learned. After the seats fiasco, 2 board members resigned partly because of abuse directed at them. This has left the club short of volunteers.


Calls for people to go are not helpful without replacements being in place.

If the CEO goes who takes over?

If Martin Gray goes, then who manages the club.

The success since 2012 is incredible, but be realistic it cannot be maintained.

Think before the vitriol and abuse flies. It's not helping the club

Yes, things are not as perfect as everyone would like them to be, but the vitriol towards fellow fans,bolsters,vstaff, coaches, board members etc is not helping the club.

For once you post a lot of sense.
This all started with the hounding out of two decent board members. The Gray outburst was a part of this so fingers cant just be pointed in his direction for the fall out from this. There are several people who need to take a good long look at themselves.

Didn't MG's efforts to get an external investor onboard start before the board members departed?


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[liddle_4_ever]

in relation to an earlier post re Singhs involvement and a hypothetical Arena return?
Dont think the goalposts have changed much since I last applied for one, but Football Foundation Grant rules mean a minimum 25 year lease on the ground has to be in place ( my club had to have ours extended to qualify) and there is certainly a repayment clause in place for a certain period unless the club folds - so getting out of that length of lease coupled with grant repayment wouldnt be cheap.

Absolutely. We can't afford to leave BM for a long time!


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[liddle_4_ever]

We need to also know what is stopping the fans putting in, and mitigate any fears that we clearly have (I'm still amazed people haven't got the odd tenner lying about to keep the most recent fund going - it's stagnant).

I begrudge donating anything while there's still talk of an investor getting onboard. I'm better off keeping my cash for when an investor ruins the club again.


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[DarloPeGi]

A 'measured' post Gramps of which I entirely agree with... although I would 'dread' another fans forum like the last one.

Personally I'm in favour of getting it right 'off the pitch' first and if that means staying in the Conference North for a while so we can get the club infrastructure right then so be it.

We need to make sure our club survives for the long term and for the next generation of fans after us.

On the pitch, I've still got faith in Gray's ability to manage this group of players.

[Vodka_Vic]

We need to also know what is stopping the fans putting in, and mitigate any fears that we clearly have (I'm still amazed people haven't got the odd tenner lying about to keep the most recent fund going - it's stagnant).

I begrudge donating anything while there's still talk of an investor getting onboard. I'm better off keeping my cash for when an investor ruins the club again.


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Question - if there was none of this investor uncertainty in the background would you invest?
If the answer is yes, then it's clear to see why the fundraising has stalled

[liddle_4_ever]

We need to also know what is stopping the fans putting in, and mitigate any fears that we clearly have (I'm still amazed people haven't got the odd tenner lying about to keep the most recent fund going - it's stagnant).

I begrudge donating anything while there's still talk of an investor getting onboard. I'm better off keeping my cash for when an investor ruins the club again.


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Question - if there was none of this investor uncertainty in the background would you invest?
If the answer is yes, then it's clear to see why the fundraising has stalled

I've donated a decent amount in the past (probably 4 figures). I'm not as flush now as I used to be but £10-20 here and there wouldn't be missed.


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[tezza]

"The success since 2012 is incredible, but be realistic it cannot be maintained."

Tell that to MG

It is becoming increasingly obvious David Johnson has not been able to persuade any relevant outside investment. The RS coup has no legs, then i guess we may have little choice but to stick with the current model we can boil this down to 2 routes of travel

1: Investment of the pitch and in the infastructure
2: Investment in the playing budget

That might have to be the outline of questions put to the fans.

I think we all know who will not be able to swallow that pill

[Alfie]

"The success since 2012 is incredible, but be realistic it cannot be maintained."

Tell that to MG

It is becoming increasingly obvious David Johnson has not been able to persuade any relevant outside investment. The RS coup has no legs, then i guess we may have little choice but to stick with the current model we can boil this down to 2 routes of travel

1: Investment of the pitch and in the infastructure
2: Investment in the playing budget

That might have to be the outline of questions put to the fans.

I think we all know who will not be able to swallow that pill

Without (1), (2) is pointless

[theoriginalfatcat]

Without (2), (1) is pointless.

[lo36789]

Without (2), (1) is pointless.

Surely you can see that one takes priority over the other?

[Santino]

This level and the level above are increasingly filled with bankrolled teams. The fact that Darlington used to be a league team is absolutely irrelevant in 2017. If we weren't Darlington, but another club which lacked that history, you'd look at our situation and have to say that playing in the Football League is an absolute pipe dream. It's pointless throwing good money after bad going boom or bust for promotion.

Get the infrastructure side of the club prioritised, let the club (in it's current form, not people's delusions of grandeur) find it's level. If fans fall by the wayside due to stagnation on the pitch then that's sad but that's the fickle nature of supporters these days. We must always plan to whatever our budget and level of support dictates.

[theoriginalfatcat]

Without (2), (1) is pointless.

Surely you can see that one takes priority over the other?

Yes I can.

However, I was trying to make the point that we still need to invest in the team, because if we don't we'll end up in a position where a top 7 finish is impossible, i.e. no seats needed. Then watch attendances (£) and interest slip away.

Both 1 and 2 are important.

[Beano]

To be honest, the priority has to be the ground, not for promotion, but because the match day experience is the driving factor behind growing the crowd.

[theoriginalfatcat]

It's a balancing act. Since we reformed, there hasn't been a single moment when we haven't had something to play for, either promotion or a play off place. Even the last few games of last season might have been relevant because of the appeal and all that.

All I'm saying is, if the team doesn't get investment and we have nothing to play for, then attendances will fall, income will fall and the dreaded "match day experience" will become worse.

[darlo reborn]

In reality MG has to say ok this season we consolidate get the ground in order then go for it next season or the season after.
At some point he has to curb his ambition and maybe use the playing budget for infrastructure

[Spyman]

It's a balancing act. Since we reformed, there hasn't been a single moment when we haven't had something to play for, either promotion or a play off place. Even the last few games of last season might have been relevant because of the appeal and all that.

All I'm saying is, if the team doesn't get investment and we have nothing to play for, then attendances will fall, income will fall and the dreaded "match day experience" will become worse.

Nothing to play for.....this season perhaps. Maybe this season and next.

But long term we'll have promotion to play for knowing that we don't need to raise money for ground improvements first.

This is a discussion around "short-termism" and you seem to be suggesting that we need to be playing for promotion this season?

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[theoriginalfatcat]

Look, I'm not arguing against you, lo, or Beano.

I see the point you're all making, but you 3 will most likely turn up whatever the situation, just like I will, however there will be many who won't, for the reasons stated above......... that's all I'm saying.

Anyway, surely we can maintain a team which can finish top 7 without too much difficulty.

[shawry]

Look, I'm not arguing against you, lo, or Beano.

I see the point you're all making, but you 3 will most likely turn up whatever the situation, just like I will, however there will be many who won't, for the reasons stated above......... that's all I'm saying.

Anyway, surely we can maintain a team which can finish top 7 without too much difficulty.

The problem is we can potentially maintain a top 7 side but if we don't meet the fundraising target then it's been a waste, and that will damage us more than mid table or flirting with relegation.

By splitting our fundraising we have gambled yet again with our future, something we said we wouldn't do as fan owned....however it feels that we have gambled every year so far and got lucky with windfalls.

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[Yarblockos]

Indeed, if we fail to build the seats then its going to be very difficult to persuade people to turn up to watch a team with zero hope of progression. Even if you are a poor side, expectations can rise after a good result and the hope (even faint) of promotion is never completely vanished. If we cannot enter the play-offs then there is absolutely zero hope. A win is nice, but nothing to get excited about. There is a big difference.

[liddle_4_ever]