Martin Gray

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Spyman
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Re: Martin Gray

Post by Spyman » Tue Jul 04, 2017 2:49 pm

Emdubya wrote:
Spyman wrote:To be honest I'm not even talking about bringing players in from the academy. I'm talking about bringing players through from our own youth teams, which do exist.

You'd think someone who runs a youth academy, independent or not, would want to build a reputation as a manager who gives youth a chance. Martin Gray's record in doing so is quite frankly very poor and you get the impression he'd always rather take the easy option of spending money on an experienced player rather than giving a youngster a chance.

Developing our own talent not only reduces the need to spend money on established players, whether transfer fees or wages, but also gives the opportunity to generate revenue by selling promising youngsters - although there's no guaranteed income from this it is exactly the sort of thing we need to do if we're going to thrive and become self-sufficient.
Have you considered for a second that the kids from the youth setup are not ready for first team action yet?.Saunders is close but not the finished article yet,Milburn is a good prospect as well but again not ready for the step up.Or should we just put them in anyway and watch them get mauled so people like you can say Gray doesn't have a clue and we should sack him.
The youth system at the club hasn't been established for very long and it can take years for good young players to come through.And don't forget that we aren't starting with the cream,they are already at Boro,Sunderland and the like.
Not sure where I said Martin Gray doesn't have a clue and we should sack him. Don't be so sensitive.

Matthew Lovegreen has been part of the first team squad for how many season's now? Two? How many chances has he been given? Why have them in the first team squad if they aren't ready.

If the players aren't ready or good enough then fair enough - I was simply making the point that Martin Gray runs a football academy and that surely it would help the reputation of that academy if it were run by someone who pushed young players into first team football when needed rather than crying out for a bigger budget.

Every player at our level, and every other level, has to start somewhere. Nathan Cartman got his break somewhere, Terry Galbraith got his break somewhere etc etc. We just don't be the club to give those young players their break at the moment.
On Sunday April 29, 2012 at 10:25 pm, Darlo Cockney wrote:Sadly some people have nothing better to do that invent rumours.

We will be playing at the arena again next season - fact.

Quakerz - if you actually attended games and spoke to people you might actually find our facts, rather than spreading s*** on this board.

DC

H1987
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Re: Martin Gray

Post by H1987 » Tue Jul 04, 2017 3:12 pm

It's phenomenally difficult at a non professional level to run a successful youth academy. Pro clubs hoover up the top talent. I can't imagine us producing a great deal until we get to a stage of being professional again. That will attract young lads to want to play for us. Right now, they're going to be more inclined to play for Gateshead, Hartlepool, York etc, as there's the chance of a pro contract if they break into the first team. That isn't the case with us right now.

Emdubya
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Re: Martin Gray

Post by Emdubya » Tue Jul 04, 2017 4:12 pm

Spyman wrote:
Emdubya wrote:
Spyman wrote:To be honest I'm not even talking about bringing players in from the academy. I'm talking about bringing players through from our own youth teams, which do exist.

You'd think someone who runs a youth academy, independent or not, would want to build a reputation as a manager who gives youth a chance. Martin Gray's record in doing so is quite frankly very poor and you get the impression he'd always rather take the easy option of spending money on an experienced player rather than giving a youngster a chance.

Developing our own talent not only reduces the need to spend money on established players, whether transfer fees or wages, but also gives the opportunity to generate revenue by selling promising youngsters - although there's no guaranteed income from this it is exactly the sort of thing we need to do if we're going to thrive and become self-sufficient.
Have you considered for a second that the kids from the youth setup are not ready for first team action yet?.Saunders is close but not the finished article yet,Milburn is a good prospect as well but again not ready for the step up.Or should we just put them in anyway and watch them get mauled so people like you can say Gray doesn't have a clue and we should sack him.
The youth system at the club hasn't been established for very long and it can take years for good young players to come through.And don't forget that we aren't starting with the cream,they are already at Boro,Sunderland and the like.
Not sure where I said Martin Gray doesn't have a clue and we should sack him. Don't be so sensitive.

Matthew Lovegreen has been part of the first team squad for how many season's now? Two? How many chances has he been given? Why have them in the first team squad if they aren't ready.

If the players aren't ready or good enough then fair enough - I was simply making the point that Martin Gray runs a football academy and that surely it would help the reputation of that academy if it were run by someone who pushed young players into first team football when needed rather than crying out for a bigger budget.

Every player at our level, and every other level, has to start somewhere. Nathan Cartman got his break somewhere, Terry Galbraith got his break somewhere etc etc. We just don't be the club to give those young players their break at the moment.
Of course it would help the academy if some players came through but I repeat,they are nowhere near,so your call to"play the young uns"is ridiculous.If and when they are,Gray will be the first to know and act accordingly.
Lovegreen has,as you say,been on the scene for a while.But guess what.He isn't good enough at the moment to play at the level we are now at.Again,Gray will know if and when he is.

shawry
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Re: Martin Gray

Post by shawry » Tue Jul 04, 2017 4:52 pm

we have a reserve team, if we aren't going to use players from it then scrap it. they only have to be used to bolster in times of injury so should be ok for that.

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Emdubya
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Re: Martin Gray

Post by Emdubya » Tue Jul 04, 2017 5:35 pm

shawry wrote:we have a reserve team, if we aren't going to use players from it then scrap it. they only have to be used to bolster in times of injury so should be ok for that.

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The reserves are a different kettle of fish from the academy kids Spyman is on about.Some handy lads playing there and certainly capable of filling the bench if required in an emergency.

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Spyman
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Re: Martin Gray

Post by Spyman » Tue Jul 04, 2017 8:13 pm

Emdubya wrote:
shawry wrote:we have a reserve team, if we aren't going to use players from it then scrap it. they only have to be used to bolster in times of injury so should be ok for that.

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The reserves are a different kettle of fish from the academy kids Spyman is on about.Some handy lads playing there and certainly capable of filling the bench if required in an emergency.
I'm not talking about 16/17 year old kids in our youth teams.

We've had plenty of youngsters (Lovegreen being an obvious answer) who have fallen by the wayside having never even been given a chance. That's all I'm saying. Hopefully I'll be proved wrong and a couple will be given the opportunity to break through - I believe I read earlier in the close season that 4 or 5, Saunders included, were very well thought of and considered good enough.

Back to the original point, we have a core squad of something like 19 players who have proved capable of a finish at the right end of the table. All focus should he on this group now and the priority for further spending should be on getting the other part of the club in a position where we can be promoted.

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On Sunday April 29, 2012 at 10:25 pm, Darlo Cockney wrote:Sadly some people have nothing better to do that invent rumours.

We will be playing at the arena again next season - fact.

Quakerz - if you actually attended games and spoke to people you might actually find our facts, rather than spreading s*** on this board.

DC

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Spyman
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Re: Martin Gray

Post by Spyman » Tue Jul 04, 2017 8:17 pm

Also, out of interest, who are the players in our reserve team?

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On Sunday April 29, 2012 at 10:25 pm, Darlo Cockney wrote:Sadly some people have nothing better to do that invent rumours.

We will be playing at the arena again next season - fact.

Quakerz - if you actually attended games and spoke to people you might actually find our facts, rather than spreading s*** on this board.

DC

super_les_mcjannet
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Re: Martin Gray

Post by super_les_mcjannet » Tue Jul 04, 2017 8:27 pm

I think the reality is that Gray has been given the budget he wanted, raising 41k + price increase means his budget hasn't reduced.

If he is working within budget then no point arguing over him looking at other players and wanting to sign players, he may even think one in but might mean one out.

I agree with the point we need to get the stand sorted as well but I can't see the board saying "I know we agreed this much for budget but we have now decided to reduce it anyhow". After everything before the season ended then this would cause big problems within the club at this stage.

Pointless saying it but Gray needs to raise some cash with a few cup games this year.

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Re: Martin Gray

Post by Spyman » Tue Jul 04, 2017 8:36 pm

super_les_mcjannet wrote:I think the reality is that Gray has been given the budget he wanted, raising 41k + price increase means his budget hasn't reduced.

If he is working within budget then no point arguing over him looking at other players and wanting to sign players, he may even think one in but might mean one out.

I agree with the point we need to get the stand sorted as well but I can't see the board saying "I know we agreed this much for budget but we have now decided to reduce it anyhow". After everything before the season ended then this would cause big problems within the club at this stage.

Pointless saying it but Gray needs to raise some cash with a few cup games this year.
Don't disagree with any of that.



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On Sunday April 29, 2012 at 10:25 pm, Darlo Cockney wrote:Sadly some people have nothing better to do that invent rumours.

We will be playing at the arena again next season - fact.

Quakerz - if you actually attended games and spoke to people you might actually find our facts, rather than spreading s*** on this board.

DC

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