AGM notice & annual accounts

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lo36789
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Re: AGM notice & annual accounts

Post by lo36789 » Fri Oct 16, 2015 8:09 am

JE93 wrote:Just a quick question? May have missed it in the report. Did it mention any more receivables on the Dan Burn transfer? Based on his appearances this season it looks like he will go past the 50 mark will this mean any more payments for us? If so this could make up for our inability to make it through a couple of rounds of the FA cup in terms of finance.
I don't think it specifically called out expected income from it. Just made the point that the ex player income is basically what has kept us relatively stable from an income/expenditure perspective.

I think we may be due it already. We know from the liquidators report that a sum from Fulham in October 2014, it just so happened that at the end of October 2014 Burn had made 24 apperances for Fulham - he made his 20th at the start of the month.

That suggests that the 'milestones' for Burn are therefore 20 games (not 25) similar to Stockdale. Burn made his 40th appearance for Fulham earlier this month, as a result we should be getting another £29k. If it is similar to the Stockdale deal then that would be it for Dan Burn apart from England call up/future transfer fee.

It wouldn't surprise me if the liquidator closed on this basis. It does say in the liquidator report they expect to close shortly (maybe it was that final Burn payment they are waiting on).

Hopefully closure of the liquidation of the old company + payment of debt of the old company by us will convince the FA that we can have our name back...here's hoping. It seems like a significant change in circumstances to warrant it being reconsidered.

JE93
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Re: AGM notice & annual accounts

Post by JE93 » Fri Oct 16, 2015 8:18 am

Cheers for clearing that up lo.

Interesting point on getting our name back too. Surely like you say the settling of the old clubs debts and closing of the liquidation process, coupled with the length of time we will have been without our name, would mean we have a strong case for returning to Darlington FC as the clubs official name.

lo36789
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Re: AGM notice & annual accounts

Post by lo36789 » Fri Oct 16, 2015 8:24 am

Carefuly saying clearing it up - it is my own assumptions based on other information. The club quite categorically said this stuff was confidential for commercial reasons.

And the last bit is just my hoping and praying. This just seems as good a reason as any to say that the last time we asked things were different - this is the situation now it is completely different.

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Robbie Painter
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Re: AGM notice & annual accounts

Post by Robbie Painter » Fri Oct 16, 2015 9:14 am

There is a % of any transfer fee for Dan Burn I believe due to DFC. He was linked with a move in the summer and isn't a regular in the first team so something may happen in the winter transfer window.

The bit about the liquidator closing shortly has been in the last 2 annnual reports as well.

lo36789
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Re: AGM notice & annual accounts

Post by lo36789 » Fri Oct 16, 2015 11:19 am

Robbie Painter wrote:There is a % of any transfer fee for Dan Burn I believe due to DFC. He was linked with a move in the summer and isn't a regular in the first team so something may happen in the winter transfer window.

The bit about the liquidator closing shortly has been in the last 2 annnual reports as well.
It would have to happen in January if anything were to come of that. He turns 24 in May and then doesn't his contract expire in the summer?

If I am not mistaken that means he could move for free without a tribunal fee involved?

I am not sure how the age thing work though it may be if you are u24 at the start of that season, in which case one would be due but only if Fulham offer a new contract on equivalent terms.

Maurice_Peddelty
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Re: AGM notice & annual accounts

Post by Maurice_Peddelty » Sat Oct 17, 2015 7:47 am

Bogratsteve wrote:
Maurice_Peddelty wrote:I didn't say they shouldn't go. I said they could balance their priorities a little.
Why? They are free to do what they want and should not have to justify their actions for the good of the club or not, it's not a communist state last time I looked, so please stop implying they are doing something wrong it's very offensive and insulting.

Would love to know where you get your figures from to justify the claim that they go to away games and not home, I have seen little evidence of this having done a lot of away games and home and see the same faces at both.
I can’t make my mind up whether you’re a very sensitive soul or just petulant but this isn’t the first time you have played the ‘offended and insulted’ card whenever someone has made a suggestion involving modified behaviour of some kind. Either way, I’m guessing you were a teacher’s nightmare at school.

Evidence? I personally know of 4 Darlington based fans that either only attend away games or certainly attach a higher priority to travelling away rather than going to Heritage Park. However if I was to name them on here the mods would have a field day. Although I know only 4 in my circle of acquaintances, I have no idea what the full extent could be, which is why I deliberately chose the word ‘some’ denoting an indefinite number. So please don’t twist my words.

Anyway, this is a distraction from the main thrust of my original post which was in response to Robbie Painter’s very valid point that based on current crowds at Heritage Park, the current playing budget is unsustainable based on the operating losses sustained in each of the 3 seasons we have played there. My point was that to be sustainable we would need an acceptance by a majority of fans that a fan owned club means fan funded.

A significant number of fans do fully get the fan ownership/fan funded concept but currently they are very much in the minority as evidenced by the numbers contributing to the lottery, membership of DFCSG and the overall operating income of the Club. We would therefore need a shift in mindset to a point where a majority of fans get the fan ownership/fan funded concept in order to significantly increase the regular income to the Club.

I haven’t had time yet to fully read through Martin Jesper’s financial report but Craig Stoddart’s summary published in yesterday’s Echo backs up everything I’m saying.

Darlo Pete’s suggestions aren’t the answer. The Football Club Board can’t set a budget based on the income that may or may not come from a series of events which may or may not happen in the future. We already have a Fundraising Group that has been operating for 3 years but after the initial burst of enthusiasm and success, the numbers involved and the level of activity has been in continual decline. The Fundraising Group has put on a number of events over the years; some well attended, some not so. But overall the amount of money raised for the Club has been relatively modest compared to the actual amount of money spent at the events. This is because the venue/performers invariably take the lions share. For efficiency, nothing beats putting money directly into our Football Club. Whilst I agree with Darlo Pete that fundraising events do provide an opportunity to encourage contributions from those outside the Darlington FC fraternity, inevitably the usual contributors will end up going out of loyalty, so the burden will still fall on them.

Yes, you are right we do not live in a communist state and fans should be able to make their own free choices as they always have and always will do. But it doesn’t take a maths degree to work out the consequences of taking one set of choices compared to another.

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coles
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Re: AGM notice & annual accounts

Post by coles » Sat Oct 17, 2015 9:14 am

Maurice_Peddelty wrote:
Bogratsteve wrote:
Maurice_Peddelty wrote:I didn't say they shouldn't go. I said they could balance their priorities a little.
Why? They are free to do what they want and should not have to justify their actions for the good of the club or not, it's not a communist state last time I looked, so please stop implying they are doing something wrong it's very offensive and insulting.

Would love to know where you get your figures from to justify the claim that they go to away games and not home, I have seen little evidence of this having done a lot of away games and home and see the same faces at both.
I can’t make my mind up whether you’re a very sensitive soul or just petulant but this isn’t the first time you have played the ‘offended and insulted’ card whenever someone has made a suggestion involving modified behaviour of some kind. Either way, I’m guessing you were a teacher’s nightmare at school.

Evidence? I personally know of 4 Darlington based fans that either only attend away games or certainly attach a higher priority to travelling away rather than going to Heritage Park. However if I was to name them on here the mods would have a field day. Although I know only 4 in my circle of acquaintances, I have no idea what the full extent could be, which is why I deliberately chose the word ‘some’ denoting an indefinite number. So please don’t twist my words.

Anyway, this is a distraction from the main thrust of my original post which was in response to Robbie Painter’s very valid point that based on current crowds at Heritage Park, the current playing budget is unsustainable based on the operating losses sustained in each of the 3 seasons we have played there. My point was that to be sustainable we would need an acceptance by a majority of fans that a fan owned club means fan funded.

A significant number of fans do fully get the fan ownership/fan funded concept but currently they are very much in the minority as evidenced by the numbers contributing to the lottery, membership of DFCSG and the overall operating income of the Club. We would therefore need a shift in mindset to a point where a majority of fans get the fan ownership/fan funded concept in order to significantly increase the regular income to the Club.

I haven’t had time yet to fully read through Martin Jesper’s financial report but Craig Stoddart’s summary published in yesterday’s Echo backs up everything I’m saying.

Darlo Pete’s suggestions aren’t the answer. The Football Club Board can’t set a budget based on the income that may or may not come from a series of events which may or may not happen in the future. We already have a Fundraising Group that has been operating for 3 years but after the initial burst of enthusiasm and success, the numbers involved and the level of activity has been in continual decline. The Fundraising Group has put on a number of events over the years; some well attended, some not so. But overall the amount of money raised for the Club has been relatively modest compared to the actual amount of money spent at the events. This is because the venue/performers invariably take the lions share. For efficiency, nothing beats putting money directly into our Football Club. Whilst I agree with Darlo Pete that fundraising events do provide an opportunity to encourage contributions from those outside the Darlington FC fraternity, inevitably the usual contributors will end up going out of loyalty, so the burden will still fall on them.

Yes, you are right we do not live in a communist state and fans should be able to make their own free choices as they always have and always will do. But it doesn’t take a maths degree to work out the consequences of taking one set of choices compared to another.
Absolutely spot on Maurice, problem we have is that most fans have a sort sighted view looking only at the next 10 games as a window.

It is clear we need to address the income coming home was cited as the answer to our problems but that is still unresolved.

I believe we are approaching a crossroad in our life as a fan owned club. The finances coming in need to be boosted in order to improve the playing budget if we are to continue through the leagues, that has to come from commercial activity and unfortunately the fans pockets.

lo36789
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Re: AGM notice & annual accounts

Post by lo36789 » Sat Oct 17, 2015 9:59 am

coles wrote:The finances coming in need to be boosted in order to improve the playing budget if we are to continue through the leagues, that has to come from commercial activity and unfortunately the fans pockets.
And the more fans we have the lighter the burden on each individual...the bit I took most from is the revenue generation.

The most worrying figure in all the account is the ratio of concession fans we now have. It just gets more and more and I would suspect it lands mostly in the elderly category rather than the student/armed forces!

I wonder if we could do some sort of deal with Arriva and make the equivalent cost of the return on the X1 £1.30 (it is £4.30 now). We'd somehow need to demonstrate that there is benefit to Arriva, or at least that there is little risk to Arriva (ideally for the same cost to them, the bus is running anyway, we'd increase their revenues beyond what they currently are).

I am not sure how it would work but in my mind if the driver had 'tokens' or something in the bus and then anyone buying a ticket to the darlo game would get one. They hand it over as they go through the turnstile (get £3 off their match ticket) and then we do reconciliation at the end of the game. 'Sell' the tokens back to Arriva for £3 after the game.

If 100 people get that bus service at the moment, if the total volume could increase to 400 then Arriva would be evens. It may be incredibly over optimistic but if we co-ordinated it with the pubs near the bus stop in the town centre. Then maybe...just maybe?

love it!
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Re: AGM notice & annual accounts

Post by love it! » Sat Oct 17, 2015 11:52 am

I have no idea why an additional bus service/commercial agreement would create any form of additional income. We have a perfectly good coach service run via the lads at the Cleveland Bridge social club and the supports trust. Any spare revenue generated here is given to the club. No reason to suggest a commercial arrangement with Arriva when this service benefits the club already

lo36789
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Re: AGM notice & annual accounts

Post by lo36789 » Sat Oct 17, 2015 6:27 pm

Seriously?

You can't see how paying £1 for transport would benefit the club more than fans having to pay £4? You can't work it out at all?

I will answer it for you. It means it is less expense to get to the game this encouraging more to attend, increasing attendances. It looks to remove the 'Bishop is hard to get to excuse' and furthermore creates a buzz about the club in the town centre before the game potentially encouraging some stragglers...

The correct drawback is that season ticket fans end up out of pocket. As they can't get their money back on the gate.

bga
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Re: AGM notice & annual accounts

Post by bga » Wed Oct 28, 2015 11:26 am

Help please? When I try and open or save these documents using PDF, each page has the club logo in dark black obliterating most of the text. Anyone know please how I can delete/disable this so I can see everything? Thanks

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