Ilkeston - back to basics

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divas
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Ilkeston - back to basics

Post by divas » Sun Sep 20, 2015 8:42 am

First and foremost we need a strong defensive performance on Monday night. Even when we've been winning we've conceded some soft goals.

I know Burgess is captain but he's got to make way and White to come in. Of course at his age White isn't a long term solution but he clearly brings out the best in Hunter and at a time when the shape of the back 4 is chronic he'll organise as well as put his head on everything. (assuming White is available as he's missed a few midweeks in the past)

Last season both Brown and White were leaders in the back 4, this season we've had virtually no leadership which is a big concern for me.

Full-back is clearly a problem area for two reasons, both full-backs are tiny leaving us susceptible to the diagonal ball and both like to get up the pitch as much as possible. I really like Watson but if we're playing Mitchell at RB and let's face it we don't have much other option then Galbraith needs to come in to add some height and stability. Long term the RB issue needs addressing.

In midfield I don't think there's too much wrong - Turnbull needs to sit in and protect a little more as he did at the start of the season and leave Portas to drive us forward. I've not been convinced by Bell and would rather see Youhill given some proper game time.

I think Gray is caught in a quandary between 4-4-2 and 4-3-3 at the moment as the latter gets more from Thommo but in a 4-3-3 we just don't seem to afford enough protection to the 2 centre backs once the full backs get caught up the pitch.

Sounds as though Armstrong was rested on Saturday and will be back on Monday. He's been a bit below par the last 2 games he's played but given the summer he had it's understandable. Having lost Nowakowski has obviously caught us out too as I'm pretty sure he was the back-up plan, but ultimately we have a bit of an unbalanced squad at the moment.

There's also a case for Dowson to start - he's looked very sharp in the last two games he's come on and scored hat-trick in the week albeit against poor opposition. However I don't think Cartman warrants being dropped. The only way Dowson would get in for me is on the right of a 4-3-3 and as above I just don't think we can risk that.

Time to grind out a 1-0

Bogratsteve
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Re: Ilkeston - back to basics

Post by Bogratsteve » Sun Sep 20, 2015 10:06 am

Armstrong was ill apparently hence missing on Saturday.

Agree with Youhill getting a start, we bought him in to link up with Cartman and so far they have played a hand full of minutes together, I know he has been injured but looks fit now so let's use him.

Agree on bringing white back into CB & giving him the armband, if only to get Hunter back in the groove.

Also think Dowson has to start, his confidence yesterday looked high and we need a quick mobile forward 2 for Thompson & Youhill to feed crosses if Armstrong is still crook.

As reluctant as I am to bring Watson out of the LB slot you may be right on Galbraith starting, I do think Watson should be tried at RB, controversial I know but he is not bad on his right foot and has the skill to cut back on to his preferred foot.

A clean sheet is vital as we know we can score, as you say back to basics.

Where Brobbel and Gibbons fit in I'm not sure and them not making the bench regularly will surely result in them wanting to go elsewhere.

Starting line up for me

Jameson
Watson Hunter White Galbraith
Youhill Portas Turnbull Thompson
Cartman Armstrong

Outfield Subs
Dowson
Mitchell
Brobbel/Bell
Burgess

m62exile
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Re: Ilkeston - back to basics

Post by m62exile » Sun Sep 20, 2015 10:34 am

Can't see MG dropping Burgess for White personally. He's invested his faith in him with the captaincy and sees him as the main man in the back four. He's not going to retract from that one easily.
We've gone from a horrible, physical, combative team to an awfully nice one. Compare last seasons back four to yesterday's and tell me which you'd rather play against!
Also, in fairness to MG he's had to give the likes of Bell some playing time to give him a chance, hopefully as we get in to the season he'll have a better idea of what everyone's capabilities are.

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theoriginalfatcat
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Re: Ilkeston - back to basics

Post by theoriginalfatcat » Sun Sep 20, 2015 11:28 am

Basic no 1. Kicking training for our goalkeeper!
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Re: Ilkeston - back to basics

Post by MCFCDarlo3 » Sun Sep 20, 2015 11:32 am

m62exile wrote:Can't see MG dropping Burgess for White personally. He's invested his faith in him with the captaincy and sees him as the main man in the back four. He's not going to retract from that one easily.
We've gone from a horrible, physical, combative team to an awfully nice one. Compare last seasons back four to yesterday's and tell me which you'd rather play against!
Also, in fairness to MG he's had to give the likes of Bell some playing time to give him a chance, hopefully as we get in to the season he'll have a better idea of what everyone's capabilities are.
No way will he drop Burgess,as you say too much at stake for MG for that.

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Re: Ilkeston - back to basics

Post by TinShedDarloFan » Sun Sep 20, 2015 11:40 am

I dont think Burgess is the problem, its the full back positions where the problems lie, too many times we were caught with 2 at the back due to full backs pushing up leaving Hunter and Burgess to cover 2 positions.

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Re: Ilkeston - back to basics

Post by shawry » Sun Sep 20, 2015 12:00 pm

Move hunter to RB and drop White back into defence. Or go the whole hog and 5 3 2

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Re: Ilkeston - back to basics

Post by divas » Sun Sep 20, 2015 12:28 pm

TinShedDarloFan wrote:I dont think Burgess is the problem, its the full back positions where the problems lie, too many times we were caught with 2 at the back due to full backs pushing up leaving Hunter and Burgess to cover 2 positions.
Yes we're being exposed by having two very attacking full-backs, but it's the job of one of the central defenders to tell them to get back and keep a good shape. Can you imagine White allowing being hung out to dry so many times without letting the full backs know exactly what was required - that's what's missing.

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Re: Ilkeston - back to basics

Post by My opinion » Sun Sep 20, 2015 1:42 pm

shawry wrote:Move hunter to RB and drop White back into defence. Or go the whole hog and 5 3 2

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If you have Burgess and White as a centre back pairing then you have no pace in the middle..Similar happened against Kendal last season when we had Brown and White there....People on here are saying that Hunter is not as he was last season but from what I have seen his pace has got us out of a few situations.
Move him to right back and you lose all he provides with his pace.

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Re: Ilkeston - back to basics

Post by Beano » Sun Sep 20, 2015 3:13 pm

I really don't think we need to panic. At all.

We're a hysterical bunch at times.

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Re: Ilkeston - back to basics

Post by lo36789 » Sun Sep 20, 2015 3:42 pm

I'd probably go with Hunter at RB as well and go White/Burgess. It might not be that quick but with Watson/Hunter either side that may be adequate cover.

I would be tempted to 4-3-3 it.

GK Jameson
DR Hunter
DC White
DC Burgess
DL Watson
CM Mitchell
CM Turnbull
CM Portas
AM Thompson
ST Armstrong/Dowson
ST Cartman

Even if we don't end up with a big man upfront that looks really solid. It also should keep any defence at this level pretty well occupied up front.

That said this could be a bit knee jerk. We may just go with he same and it will probably work it has done for most of this season...

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Re: Ilkeston - back to basics

Post by QuakerPete » Sun Sep 20, 2015 3:50 pm

The experiment of starting White up front has failed, not his fault. He's had a few great super-sub appearances in that role but it needs a proper forward to start in order to do all the other things forwards do.

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Re: Ilkeston - back to basics

Post by Darlogramps » Sun Sep 20, 2015 3:51 pm

Beano wrote:I really don't think we need to panic. At all.

We're a hysterical bunch at times.
This. We're still second in the division with a very solid record in the division.

There's no need to abandon the formation or style of play that's taken us to this point.

If we start with two actual strikers up front (rather than a 39-yr-old centre back) and get whoever plays RB to be a bit more defensively minded, we're already much improved.
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Re: Ilkeston - back to basics

Post by Quakerz » Sun Sep 20, 2015 3:58 pm

Beano wrote:I really don't think we need to panic. At all.
We don't.

People are going on like it's all falling apart and are pointing out our weaknesses. The simple fact is that we are playing against better teams who will expose us more and from time to time make us look not very good. We are going to lose more matches this season, again from simply being up against superior opposition.

Despite that, we are second in the league and are good enough to finish top 5! We need to put things in perspective here.

In any case, the biggest concern is not the team, it is the GROUND.
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Re: Ilkeston - back to basics

Post by Beano » Sun Sep 20, 2015 4:45 pm

White has a clear role to play, but it could be argued not from the start.

Our fullbacks are more than good enough, but it could be argued that we need to be a little more conservative.

Bell isn't impressing, but had to be given a fair chance and we have Brobbel and Youhill in reserve.

Tweaks, not changes.

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Re: Ilkeston - back to basics

Post by Neil Johnson » Sun Sep 20, 2015 4:52 pm

TinShedDarloFan wrote:I dont think Burgess is the problem, its the full back positions where the problems lie, too many times we were caught with 2 at the back due to full backs pushing up leaving Hunter and Burgess to cover 2 positions.
It is common practice for one full back to stay back with the centre backs, when the other full back goes forward up the wing.

With Darlo both full backs and Burgess can be in the wrong half when a counter attacks start. Burgess may think he needs to be an extra midfielder to be captain, but his absence from the back line is a concern.

There is poor kicking from the goalie and weak attempts to clear our lines to add to the list of this season's defensive faults.

Darlo have done well to be pressing for top slot, but they will need to sort out the basic mistakes to keep up the good works.

Is Sean Gregan still functioning as the defensive coach?

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Re: Ilkeston - back to basics

Post by super_les_mcjannet » Sun Sep 20, 2015 5:39 pm

Definitely in the no need to panic camp, obviously as a team and defensively we need to improve but we are 2nd in the league which is a much better league than the one we were in last year.

The idea that Gray is going to drop his 27 year old Captain to bring in 39 year old Alan White because we have lost 2 games with some dodgy defensive displays I just can't see happening (I do rate White but Gray is looking long term, 5 years not just now). If I am honest I find the vote online at the Echo poor, it’s an overreaction and not needed.

Saying that some improved organisation and performances at the back are needed, we are no longer in a league where we just turn up most weeks and win, this is something I think us fans need to accept.

I can see the idea of bringing Galbraith back in although Watson hasn’t done much wrong to deserve it, having Armstrong back in the fold on Mon would be a bonus.
Last edited by super_les_mcjannet on Sun Sep 20, 2015 5:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Ilkeston - back to basics

Post by Comfortably_numb » Sun Sep 20, 2015 5:46 pm

Quakerz wrote:
Beano wrote:I really don't think we need to panic. At all.
We don't.

People are going on like it's all falling apart and are pointing out our weaknesses. The simple fact is that we are playing against better teams who will expose us more and from time to time make us look not very good. We are going to lose more matches this season, again from simply being up against superior opposition.

Despite that, we are second in the league and are good enough to finish top 5! We need to put things in perspective here.

In any case, the biggest concern is not the team, it is the GROUND.
This...times a squillion.

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Re: Ilkeston - back to basics

Post by D_F_C » Sun Sep 20, 2015 6:02 pm

Quakerz wrote:
Beano wrote:I really don't think we need to panic. At all.
We don't.

People are going on like it's all falling apart and are pointing out our weaknesses. The simple fact is that we are playing against better teams who will expose us more and from time to time make us look not very good. We are going to lose more matches this season, again from simply being up against superior opposition.

Despite that, we are second in the league and are good enough to finish top 5! We need to put things in perspective here.

In any case, the biggest concern is not the team, it is the GROUND.
All the members of the hysteria bunch just need to read this. There's a few tweaks to make here and there but we are second, one point off top.

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Re: Ilkeston - back to basics

Post by al_quaker » Sun Sep 20, 2015 7:37 pm

super_les_mcjannet wrote: If I am honest I find the vote online at the Echo poor, it’s an overreaction and not needed.
Yes it's very poor indeed. Very disappointed in whoever decided that it would be a good idea to put that up.

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Re: Ilkeston - back to basics

Post by darlo reborn » Sun Sep 20, 2015 8:16 pm

Draw or Win tomorrow and we are TOP what more can you say even if it may be for only 24 hrs

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Re: Ilkeston - back to basics

Post by Darlo_Pete » Sun Sep 20, 2015 10:55 pm

Armstrong had a bad cold on Saturday, so may be doubtful for tomorrow night.

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Re: Ilkeston - back to basics

Post by Quaker0006 » Sun Sep 20, 2015 11:11 pm

Quakerz wrote:
Beano wrote:I really don't think we need to panic. At all.
The simple fact is that we are playing against better teams who will expose us more and from time to time make us look not very good. We are going to lose more matches this season, again from simply being up against superior opposition.
No one is saying otherwise. Its a much tougher league and would expect to drop points but a lot of the issues were caused by our lack of organisation and players wandering around in masses of space. They could have had a few more in all honesty while in no way outplaying us
D_F_C wrote:
Quakerz wrote:
Beano wrote:I really don't think we need to panic. At all.
All the members of the hysteria bunch just need to read this. There's a few tweaks to make here and there but we are second, one point off top.
[/quote]

Its not hysteria to say weve been poor defensively. Theres been other times but the last two games have been very poor and haven't learnt from it. Yes im sure we would have taken league position but could have been top and into next round of the cup. If this issue at the back continues, there will be better teams than Hyde beating us

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